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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
Hello,

I have a 2011 Chrysler 200 hardtop and well was working fine and then took it for the first drive of the season and opened just fine and when I got home the top will not close. Its in the trunk still and one side of the trunk is open about 4 inches the other side is shut as normal. It will not go up or down its stuck right where it is..

So here is what happened. I go for a a drive.. top goes down fine no messages. I get home top will not go up only passenger side of trunk lifts up a little (but will go down flat into trunk when I push button down) - drivers side does nothing stays down. I try this a few times same thing.. passengers sides goes up about 4-5 inches and then back down when I pushed the button to do so.

Then I come to this forum and read about an emergency lift sequenced.. So I tried that.. and that is when the passenger side lifted up a little about 4 inches (like it was earlier) but now will not go back down it stays lifted up since I did the emergency lift. Photos attached.

I do have a Bluedriver code reader and the codes are B25A2 (Unknown power top sequence), B2520 Convertible top header latch control circuit open, B2546 Decklid Latch limit switch circuit low and B2545 Decklid latch limit switch permeance.

I should state also that the messages on dash screen is "Top not secure" and "hardtop malfunction".

I brought it into Dave Smith Auto service and they said.. its an autobody issue and said take it to a body shop "Top is rubbing on arm in trunk"... ???? what does that mean?

One side of the hydraulics does not even move a little bit on the drivers side. the other side is stuck up about 4 inches. I think they just didn't want to deal with it and sent me on my way.

I bought this car after my husband passed away last year to I guess give me a little mental boost. Now I feel it is a nightmare. The top is down .. its been a rainy month. I have to keep it under a tarp so it doesn't get wet inside.

Any ideas? Is there a way that it can be manually raised until I can get it fixed? Would an autobody shop know what was wrong with it? Dave Smith service center obviously didn't check any codes. I should have checked codes before I brought it to them.. but Dummy me I did not I checked the codees when I got home.

I'm here by myself - is there a way to manually lift the hardtop .. (I could probably get a couple friends to help) at least then I can use the car and not worry about it raining.
Does what it is doing seem like an autobody issue? Seems mechanical to me. I have no problem getting it fixed.. I just want it fixed.. but I am doubtful an autobody shop is where I should take it. Seems like its mechanical versus autobody..

Please excuse the mess around the yard.. I am having some major remodeling done and so everything is at a total disarray.

Please review photos.
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Wheel Car Tire Vehicle Hood


Automotive parking light Vehicle registration plate Car Automotive tail & brake light Vehicle
 

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To force the top to close

Pull the top close button 5 times in 2 seconds and hold - this sequence may take over 2 minutes to complete.

The top will begin to close. This sequence will override any safety or sensor settings.

Pay special attention to the operation - if there is any crunching or binding you need to stop and to get to a dealer or convertible top shop.
 

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2016 Chrysler 200 S, 1998 Sebring JX
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Welcome to the forum. I'm sorry to hear of the passing of your husband.
I found some service information on the fault codes, except for B25A2. There is no B25A2 listed in the Chrysler diagnostic information. I can only think a typo or some code from a non-Chrysler scan tool? There is no text that states 'Unknown power top sequence'.

Beautiful car. The rainbow aura in the 2nd to last image must be from the hubby?

The most common culprits on an 11 year-old power top would be from broken wires from the flexing of top-up/top-down motion. There are a number of switches that have to work in sequence during the top operation, up or down.
If you 'Search Community' at the top of the page, you will find discussions on power hardtop issues.

A scan tool may be necessary to do a lot of the diagnosis on the top, but many problems like broken wires or damaged switches can be seen visually if you know what to look for. Even if you have to take it into a shop, just having an awareness of the faults & what they mean will help you follow what they find the problem to be.
I'm sure that Dave Smith Auto has reputable & skilled technicians. The even can read Chrysler PTCM (power top control module) codes.
A Chrysler dealer service dept may be more familiar with these and have the factory parts, factory training & special tools needed for a competent repair.
Start with the 'diagnostic fee' and go from there.

DTCs=diagnostic trouble codes, same as fault codes.
Voltage high=usually circuit open (shorted to voltage). Voltage low=usually circuit short to ground.

Font Parallel Screenshot Number Document


Font Number Screenshot Document Parallel


Rectangle Slope Font Parallel Pattern


Rectangle Violet Font Parallel Electric blue


Rectangle Slope Font Parallel Pattern


Font Material property Screenshot Rectangle Parallel



Rectangle Slope Parallel Font Pattern


Font Material property Parallel Screenshot Rectangle


There was a bulletin for a possible open ground released that could cause this. I've only seen it once (see attached).
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Welcome to the forum. I'm sorry to hear of the passing of your husband.
I found some service information on the fault codes, except for B25A2. There is no B25A2 listed in the Chrysler diagnostic information. I can only think a typo or some code from a non-Chrysler scan tool? There is no text that states 'Unknown power top sequence'.

Beautiful car. The rainbow aura in the 2nd to last image must be from the hubby?

The most common culprits on an 11 year-old power top would be from broken wires from the flexing of top-up/top-down motion. There are a number of switches that have to work in sequence during the top operation, up or down.
If you 'Search Community' at the top of the page, you will find discussions on power hardtop issues.

A scan tool may be necessary to do a lot of the diagnosis on the top, but many problems like broken wires or damaged switches can be seen visually if you know what to look for. Even if you have to take it into a shop, just having an awareness of the faults & what they mean will help you follow what they find the problem to be.
I'm sure that Dave Smith Auto has reputable & skilled technicians. The even can read Chrysler PTCM (power top control module) codes.
A Chrysler dealer service dept may be more familiar with these and have the factory parts, factory training & special tools needed for a competent repair.
Start with the 'diagnostic fee' and go from there.

DTCs=diagnostic trouble codes, same as fault codes.
Voltage high=usually circuit open (shorted to voltage). Voltage low=usually circuit short to ground.

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View attachment 59863

There was a bulletin for a possible open ground released that could cause this. I've only seen it once (see attached).
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 · (Edited)
I brought it to Dave Smith Service Center (which has a specific Chrysler service section) the largest in the USA and they are the ones who said bring it to an auto body repair shop and did not even bother to read the codes or investigate any further.

I guess will contact an auto body repair shop and go from there. I'm alone so not like I have the knowledge to read all the circuitry follow the wiring etc. I do have to bring it somewhere to get repaired.

Thank you for the response
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 · (Edited)
To force the top to close

Pull the top close button 5 times in 2 seconds and hold - this sequence may take over 2 minutes to complete.

The top will begin to close. This sequence will override any safety or sensor settings.

Pay special attention to the operation - if there is any crunching or binding you need to stop and to get to a dealer or convertible top shop.

The emergency force close is what I found in this forum (weeks ago when I first had the close issue) and tried that initially which made it worse and I did not hear any crunching or weird noises but seems to have made it worse.

I brought it already to a dealer shop and they said it was a Auto body repair issue not a mechanical issue.

Thank you for the reply. .
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
With one side of the back lifted about 4 inches the other side closed tight its as if the lifting Mechanism went out of alignment or something. So no matter what I do it will not move up or down.. it is stuck crooked. Thus I do not think even if all wiring and everything was good.. that it would lift properly due to being out of alignment.

When I opened the trunk to view I did notice the cargo panel that is supposed to be in place in the back into those slots are not in the slots. It was in the slots when I put the top down initially so how that even moved out of the slots I have no idea.. also noticed that cargo panel I can not move at all in the trunk now to even put into the slots as its stuck in the trunk tight..

Maybe they (Dave smith Auto Service Center) that why they suggested auto body repair shop as the lifting mechanism the brackets etc all have to be taken apart and re-aligned again??

I guess will just call auto body repair shop and see what they say since Dave smith Auto repair center recommended that is what I do.
 

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This is the thread I was looking for. See the images in post #6 & #7. Any help?
Is this what they mean by: "Top is rubbing on arm in trunk"... ???? what does that mean?

 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
This is the thread I was looking for. See the images in post #6 & #7. Any help?
Is this what they mean by: "Top is rubbing on arm in trunk"... ???? what does that mean?

Thank you. I looked in the trunk and the storage compartment is not in the side brackets/slots anymore and its tight in the trunk and won't let me move it anywhere.

Maybe that is the issue. but weird why it would move around in the trunk on its own .. it was in the slots and in there correct when I initially put the top down otherwise the top would not even have went down. .

I guess auto body shop is where I need to take it then. Now finding one that will work on a hardtop convertible will be an issue for me since I do not live by any big cities.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Actually now that Inspected what's going on in the trunk a bit closer. One side of the hardtop the first section of the top has shifted over to the right and is hitting the lifting arm thus its not allowing the motion to go up or down.

I suspect what happened is the hydraulics went out on the left side and when I hit the button to close the top the right side lifted up but the left side stayed down thus "tweaking" the whole alignment of the whole lifting mechanism. Oh this is going to be a fun one to even find a shop that will work on it. So far have not found anyone or place.

At this point I just want the top up.. and will leave it up.. at least. I can't use the vehicle the way it is now (well I can when its sunny and it is a bit ugly now) but forget about any chance of rain.

Oh hum.. life is grand sometimes. .. I'm just on a run of bad luck.. and for me.. instead of going in 3's.. I'm on about 15 right not.

Thanks everyone for your responses. Wish me luck to find someone o work on it.
Not sure who that will be if a Chrysler dealership service center don't even want to.
 

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Good. I'm glad that you saw what is (or isn't) happening. If the switches don't see the closure at the right time (or at all), it may set the 'switch open' (switch remains off) faults.
The left-right side imbalance can be hydraulic or it maybe mechanical, like binding joints? Hopefully nothing has bent. I think that the software knows enough to stop before any damage occurs.
A second pair of hands may be able to assist the top mechanism in lifting & closing the top for now.
There are left & right hydraulic cylinder to raise & lower the top. They can leak and make an oily mess, but usually the pump will get noisy (whirr) from the air in the lines.

There is probably very little chance of corrosion where you are. Is the vehicle driven year round and do you exercise the top occasionally?

The pump & electric motor is #32. It is behind the rear seat.
The main lift cylinders are #23 & #35. There are smaller hydraulic actuators to fold & unfurl the top panels.
The main hydraulic lines are #29, #30 & #39.
The fluid used is conventional Dexron ATF. There should be no fluid loss as long as you don't have leaks.
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These are the actual top panels.
Slope Font Parallel Auto part Art
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
OK so .. I have narrowed it down to .. its the trunk lid that is not opening... the hardtop itself should be fine in the trunk.

So what controls the trunk lid lifting up and back?

Seems the drivers side Trunk lid does nothing and the passengers side try's to open but is stuck up about 4 inches.

I think if I can get the trunk lid to operate the rest of the hardtop lifting up and over hopefully will do what it is supposed to do.
Could I have them manually flip up the trunk lid and then press the up switch? Do you think the top will the do its thing?

I found a couple relatives (that are mechanics) that will work on it for me but they are coming from out of state and only have a day to help me. So would like to give them as much info as possible.

What controls the trunk lid arms is it a motor or hydraulics?

Switches - fuses etc.?


Thank you,.
 

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Attached is repair guide for the top. In it is a procedure to put the decklid into a service position. I would suggest getting the appcar-diagfca app (and OBD link that connects the app to the OBD port) to fully be able to use the repair guide. Being able to see the status of switches would seem to be a definite plus. There is a step-by-step guide for operating the top one action at a time. This is a manual process and will override any switch settings. It should be possible to close the top once the decklid is in the service position.

To me it seems the left side hydraulic cylinder may not be operating properly. One of the first actions when the cylinder extends is it pulls a cable to release the decklid forward latches (the things that allows the decklid and trunk latch to rotate up). You will see this cable hooked over the top of both cylinders If both of the decklid forward latches do not release the decklid is not able to rotate up.

This is a rather extended link but it is a good dialogue regarding diagnostic steps starting at post #53 regarding the deckbar switches setting the decklid into the service position. Note the cautionary notes and prop needed to keep the decklid in the service position.

 

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I was looking for my MasterTech training materials, but the repair guide above should cover it.
A couple of more helpful documents attached.
I agree that some kind of higher end scan tool may be necessary for electrical tests.
 

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With the trunk open and top closed (hopefully), I would suggest removing the panels so you can see the mechanism better.

The rear panel with the latch opening is held in place by 4 fasteners. The spare tire cover needs to be pulled out. Pull the lower edge of the rear panel forward to release. Then pull the top edge up.

The side panels are held in place with one push in fastener and one screw under the large cap towards the front. The one part that would be difficult with the top stored is the side panels are held in place under the cargo shield mounting bracket. If you are able to get the top closed, you will have access to the nuts.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
THANK YOU everyone! I did find a shop that works on hardtop retrackable's. So I think this time around best for me to have someone who knows what they are doing plus get a repor going with someone locally so I have a back up plan should I need to have work done again...

BUT all the information provided certainly is helpful should I experience something like this again. I will read through all that was suggested so I am more prepared what to look for.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 · (Edited)
There is probably very little chance of corrosion where you are. Is the vehicle driven year round and do you exercise the top occasionally?
I haven't been driving it in the winters (this acutally was my first winter since I purchased it last fall) but I did not drive it all winter and kept the top up and parked.. I did not realize one should exercise the top occasionally?

So its better to use it more going up and down then to not ?

I think when this happened it probably was only the 3rd or 4th time since last Fall that I opened or closed the top? I take that is not good and I should use it more not less?

I've never owned a convertible before so this is all so new to me.

Thank you.. I'm learning so much.
 

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Very good. Please let us know how this turns out; good for our collective knowledge and diagnosing issues.

One suggestion, ask the shop if they would lube the top mechanism. I use a spray white lithium grease, gets into the mechanism fairly well and drys to a nice grease that stays in place.
 
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