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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
In terms of oil degradation with mileage, is it hard on oil or not really? I know it depends on usage, short trips vs highway etc - but in general?

I used to drive a Mazda CX-7 with a 2.3T engine: turbo, direct injection, high temps, fuel dilution, possible knocking, high octane gas required, (slight) oil consumption etc. Short oil change intervals were a must, it was killing the oil rather fast. 3.6 V6 doesn't have any of that, so it obviously doesn't degrade oil as much. Also the 9HP makes sure to run it on low rpms most of the time. On the other hand, it runs rather hot, at least judging from the coolant temps as we don't have any numbers for the oil beside the gauge unfortunately.

So what would you say?
 

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Oil consumption in itself isn't a bad thing. I would expect a turbo engine to consume more oil. As an old mechanic once told me: "At least you can tell tha the oil is getting up there'.

The Pentastar generally has good oil control as long as there are no oil leaks. The biggest factors in Pentastar oil burning might be a non-OEM PCV valve (too much flow) or poor oil quality. I've also seen PCVs with too little flow spit oil out the breather hose into the air cleaner. Under most conditions, the breather should draw make-up air into the crankcase, not the other way around.

Use the correct viscosity of a premium API-certified motor oil that conforms to Chrysler MS-6395. Synthetics are good.
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Evert carmaker has oil consumption guidelines, and MOPAR is among the highest.

2012-2013: Chrysler Adjusts Motor Oil Consumption Guidelines
Chrysler has adjusted its acceptable motor oil consumption guidelines for 2012-2013 Chrysler, Dodge and Jeep gasoline vehicles (Chrysler Bulletin #09-001-12 Engine Oil Consumption Guideline):

First 50,000 miles of engine life: one quart per 2,000 miles
Engines with over 50,000 miles: one quart per 750 miles
Aggressive driving conditions: one quart per 500 miles

May 8, 2020 — A Chrysler engine oil consumption lawsuit alleges vehicles equipped with 2.4L Tigershark MultiAir II engines shut down suddenly and without warning even when the oil change indicators do not yet recommend oil changes.

Included in the Chrysler Tigershark engine oil consumption class action lawsuit are these models.

2015–2016 Chrysler 200 (Only showing this one here).

Nothing alarming with the Pentastar.
 

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American cars aren't even in the Top 30 oil drinkers. It is mostly European cars & Subaru.
Porsche & Subaru use the horizontal 'boxer' style engine.

Excessive oil consumption usually isn't recall-worthy, but in the case of the FCA 2.4L (TigerShark) MultiAir, the valves won't open fully without good oil pressure. The 'stalling' problem because of low oil was a safety issue & the recall was about that.
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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
@Powerslavepa, @200_S_AWD thank you for your replies.

To clarify though - this is not about oil consumption. I have none after 5000km/~3000 miles on Petro Canada Supreme Synthethic 5W20 since I bought the car, so it doesn't seem to burn any oil, which is fine.

I'm rather talking about the oil degradation. Some engines have a reputation of being heavy on oil, especially turbo engines with DI we see a lot here in Europe, for which relatively short oil change intervals are advised due to fuel dilution, high temps etc. that murder oil fast. The Pentastar engine is naturally aspirated, no turbo, no DI, so I assume it's not too heavy on oil, but I'd like to hear some opinions.
 

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A big factor of oil life is how & under what conditions the car is driven. The Pentastar oil stays clean for a long time, but the owners manual says to change it once a year regardless of the 'oil life' left.
10,000 mile (16,000 km) oil change intervals are possible.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
I change oil once a year and drive no more than 5000-5500miles/yr, so that would be my interval regardless of the "oil life" %.

As for conditions, it's mostly highway driving + occasional city driving on very short distances. I wouldn't say it's harsh.

All right, thank you.
 

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Same here. I don't drive much.
 
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I have the 3.6L Pentastar engine in my 2013 Dodge Caravan R/T and my 2015 Chrysler 200S AWD with 129,000 and 258,500 miles respectively. Both were 1 owner vehicles when I bought them and were maintained by Chrysler dealerships throughout their initial ownership, including oil changes. There is no excessive oil degradation on either engine that can't be attributed to the type of driving or weather conditions on either engine.

This should be very telling, with the Caravan R/T at over 10.5 years old and especially on the 200S with over a quarter million miles on the engine. Of note; I've changed the PCV valves, spark plugs and coils on both engines, as well as the usual maintenance items on them for peak efficiency!
 

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Even if the car calls for 5W20, I am using 5W30. I will never, EVER use a w20 oil. ALL that is for is to satisfy CAFE MPG guidelines. I will be using 5W40 in mine once I get it, later this week. However, I checked and the V6 calls for 5W30 anyway. There were two girls that owned Jeeps where I work, both had the 2.4 engine in it. I told the BOTH of them, DO NOT use 0W20 or 5W20 in your engines, use 5W30 at the very least, your car will thank you for it. The one girl did not take my advise, which is fine, she went through TWO engines. The other, not a single problem, AND she thanked me for it after seeing the other chick blew two motors... I run 1200 miles a week, which is over 60,000 a year, and they ran more... I change my oil every 7-8 weeks with this job. I used to run 93,000 miles a year when I had the Virginia route. Not one of my cars blew a motor, head, nothing. I am on my 9th car on going on 9 years of doing this job... Why so many? DEER IMPACTS, not mechanical failure. I just sold my Camaro 3.6 V6 (LLT) with 304,050 miles on it. ALL 5 of my VWs were totaled, in one way or another; deer, and one crushed by VW (Diesel). Every other car, I sold, and is still on the road today, all over 150,000 miles on them. Using 5W30 over 5W20, you may lose a MPG or so, but well worth the longevity of the engine.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 · (Edited)
I will never, EVER use a w20 oil. ALL that is for is to satisfy CAFE MPG guidelines.
There was a interesting thread on Bitog forums regarding the Pentastar and oil viscocity where an actual design engineer who worked on this engine shared some interesting info.

First of all, YES, the fuel economy and CAFE was behind going from SAE30 to 20, not a secret. BUT, they spent millions of $ on wear/viscosity testing and actually revised the engine at some point, so it now runs better on 0-5W20 than 5W30 it called for originally. Without going into details, testing showed that 5W20 caused an increased wear on some parts while 5W30 on the others - in certain circumstances. After the engine was revised in 2014 (then later in 2016 I think), SAE20 was no longer a compromise but became the first choice having the longevity in mind.

I have 0 knowledge about the 2.4, but I wouldn't worry about SAE20 in more recent Pentastars.

@SilverStreak thanks, btw I have 100k km/60k miles in mine, when should I think about changing spark plugs? Not sure, but I assume I have still the factory ones. No issues so far tho.
 

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It is always best to follow the factory recommendations & maintenance schedules. See your owners manual.
I opt for the full synthetic. It is worth the little extra cost.
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Wrong viscosity (weight) ofengine oil can cause a 'ck eng' light and fault code.
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The entire auto industry is calling for lighter viscosity engine oils. It is more than having less internal viscous drag and better fuel economy.
MultiAir, VVT/VCT and MDS all require engine oil-controlled actuators with minimal lag time. Heavier oils will slow the normally quick reaction times down.
 
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I never follow oil weight guidelines:
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2010 Camaro V6, with the infamous LLT engine. The longest I was able to keep a car doing this job... Sold it, still running strong. 5W40
Rotella T6 or Delo400, winter, 15W40 Summer, Delo 400; both diesel engine oils.

2006 HHR:
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2007 Charger, 116,500 when sold, dude's son has it now. I changed the oil every 25,000 miles in this, to prove a point synthetics last...
2013 Jetta "S": 198,394, Totaled
2013 Jetta TDI: 243,423, Bought Back, Crushed.
2015 Jetta Sport: 175,312, totaled, then a Rental a week later at the SAME SPOT!
2012 Jetta SE: 154,678, Totaled.

And a few more + a couple a motorcycles. I put 1200 miles a week on a car, so, I am changing the oil every 7-8 weeks. All highway miles.
Longevity is what I need.

I see a lot of issues with the 200, and I am regretting buying it... I had no choice, so we'll see. It currently has
75,000 miles on it. CLEAN underneath. Will put an ECO tune in it, or 87 performance. I get better MPG with
my Mustang with a 91 Tune. I guess we'll see soon...
 

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There was a interesting thread on Bitog forums regarding the Pentastar and oil viscocity where an actual design engineer who worked on this engine shared some interesting info.

First of all, YES, the fuel economy and CAFE was behind going from SAE30 to 20, not a secret. BUT, they spent millions of $ on wear/viscosity testing and actually revised the engine at some point, so it now runs better on 0-5W20 than 5W30 it called for originally. Without going into details, testing showed that 5W20 caused an increased wear on some parts while 5W30 on the others - in certain circumstances. After the engine was revised in 2014 (then later in 2016 I think), SAE20 was no longer a compromise but became the first choice having the longevity in mind.

I have 0 knowledge about the 2.4, but I wouldn't worry about SAE20 in more recent Pentastars.

@SilverStreak thanks, btw I have 100k km/60k miles in mine, when should I think about changing spark plugs? Not sure, but I assume I have still the factory ones. No issues so far tho.
The Caravan had 116,000 miles when I changed plugs and although there were no issues and performance was good I was going to do it because I couldn't be certain on their condition. Turns out they were the original plugs (Champion/MOPAR), heavily worn with the gap wider than spec. I was changing over to the Pentastar "upgrade" lower intake, so it was an opportune time to do all the maintenance including the spark plugs and the PCV valve.

Same thing with the 200S, although a plug change was supposedly done approx. 30,000 miles before I bought the car, I still didn't know with certainty. Those plugs were lightly coated (Champion/MOPAR) and may have been changed sometime previously, but now I know when it was done and installed a set of NGK's, same as the Caravan....
 

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Champions have been the Chrysler OEM choice for decades. Lately I've also seen NGK offered.
There are 2 versions of the 2.4L. The LEV with 32K mile (51K km) copper-nickel plug & the PZEV with the 100K mile (160K km) platinum or iridium plug.
A Ruthenium plug has been released, but hasn't been approved through OEM testing yet.

LEV is a low-emission vehicle. PZEV is a partial-zero emissions vehicle. The engine sales code will tell you which one you have. The 3.6L uses Iridium plugs.
Copper has combustion 'burn' advantages & still used by racers & piston-engine aviation. A lot of science & laboratory-to-track evaluation goes into selecting your ideal spark plug.

Beware of marketing and 'miracle' spark plugs. There is no 'best' spark plug. Use what the manufacturer recommends. The recommended spark plug is the plug that was used by the engineers during engine design, development & testing.
 

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I run COPPER for performance; my Mustang.

Iridium for longevity.

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While you can't use gold or silver because they won't last under the heat, COPPER is #1 for
conductivity in a spark plug. IF you don't put more then 10k a year on a car, and you want
performance, use copper. ALL Dodge performance engines use copper plugs, including
the viper V10 engine.
 

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Champions have been the Chrysler OEM choice for decades. Lately I've also seen NGK offered.
There are 2 versions of the 2.4L. The LEV with 32K mile (51K km) copper-nickel plug & the PZEV with the 100K mile (160K km) platinum or iridium plug.
A Ruthenium plug has been released, but hasn't been approved through OEM testing yet.

LEV is a low-emission vehicle. PZEV is a partial-zero emissions vehicle. The engine sales code will tell you which one you have. The 3.6L uses Iridium plugs.
Copper has combustion 'burn' advantages & still used by racers & piston-engine aviation. A lot of science & laboratory-to-track evaluation goes into selecting your ideal spark plug.

Beware of marketing and 'miracle' spark plugs. There is no 'best' spark plug. Use what the manufacturer recommends. The recommended spark plug is the plug that was used by the engineers during engine design, development & testing.
Got it... Sometimes I think spark plugs are like brands or weights of oil in that we all have preferences. I know I do. The plugs I bought for the 3.6L engines are NGK Lazar Iridium and they're the 'plus' version of the recommended type.

I also have (2) 1984 Dodge Rampage's with 2.2L and 2.5L turbocharged/intercooled four cylinder engines. The only spark plugs that work consistently and efficiently in those engines is the old-school copper plug, but that doesn't translate to the modern engines and electronics we have today.

I couldn't agree more that although it may seem boring, anything offered as an improvement over what the manufacturers use or recommend is ill-advised and to be avoided!
 

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Based on personal and user threads about the spark plugs on the 3.6, don't wait until the 100,000 miles. Replace somewhere between 60,000-75,000 miles. I replaced with the NGK laser from autozone. 2013 200
IIRC, Black Knight, one of our original members here, reported that he found his plugs to be very worn at only about 50,000 miles. He regularly ran E85 fuel, so maybe that had a bearing, but I don't know that it would. Based on recently changing my plugs at only 30,000 miles, while I had the intake manifold off, I'd guess they should be good for 60,000, but I'm also very dubious about waiting until 100,000.
 
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