[Pentastar V6 Performance]

The AWD biases the split 60/40 to the rear . Nobody has found the limit of the 9hp yet. The reason you can put a turbo on the 300/charger/challengers is because there are kits and many more people modding them .

 

[lightsout190]

The Transmission is rated to 354ft/lbs the PTU and RDM i'm not sure but its probably around the same 350ft/lbs mark The issue would not be getting power to the ground in the AWD version at all. Now that i've got quite a few mods and i'm tuned, I have issues with traction and tires spinning at all 4 corners now. If more power was added it would absolutely be put to good use. In the cherokee the AWD system has a few more settings to change the AWD bias, but the system is smart enough that from a dead stop IF you stomp on the gas it activates the rear wheels to prevent wheel slip, if you have enough power to spin the back tires too, thats a good problem to have.

I'm going to ask you guys this, since it is a FWD vehicle explain how the vehicle can send MORE power to the rear wheels than the front? There is no mechanism for the front driveshafts to become disconnected and not power the vehicle as much. I've jacked my vehicle up (in sport mode and all the modes) and left the front tires in the air and the rear on the ground.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ox4X6YzNV0I

Power is ALWAYS going to the front wheels no matter what Jeep says. Sort of like how auto mode is FWD, yet every single time on takeoff it sends power to the rear. If you don't believe me, pull the PTU fuse and drive around you will immediately notice how its 100% fwd and changes the handling a lot.

The AWD system is completely different in the Cherokee than in the 200. The Cherokee has modes that will allow you to change the system and even run it in 4x4 high with a 50/50 split. As far as I know the 200 AWD runs in 100% FWD unless any of the following occurs:

The car is traveling at or under 9 mph.
The temperature is around 0 degrees Celsius or under.
The wipers are engaged when it’s raining.
The car is traveling up or down a steep hill.
During cornering turns where at one point 70% torque is sent to the rear wheels.
When wheel slippage is detected.

During these circumstances the split is usually around 60% front to 40% rear unless there is allot of front slippage then split goes up to 50% front to rear.

However when S mode is engaged the split is 40% front and 60% rear unless rear wheel slippage is detected.


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[Black Knight]

How much HP and torque did the Lancer Evolution put out?

Not relevant. There are more than plenty of them running well over 400HP because they are modified.

Then there's this old car:
https://www.automobilemag.com/news/dodge-neon-srt4-stage3-2/

 

[Black Knight]

The AWD system is completely different in the Cherokee than in the 200. The Cherokee has modes that will allow you to change the system and even run it in 4x4 high with a 50/50 split.

They are in fact the same, the Cherokee just has more options than the 200 on its AWD system - "snow" throttle map etc... still the same AWD system including the PTU.

Just because one vehicle has variable intermittent wipers and the other doesn't - it doesn't mean the wiper system is completely different.

 

[Tyler-98-W68]

I can assure you the awd system on the 2015-2017 200's IS the SAME as the AWD system on the Cherokees, more specifically the Active Drive 1 System available on the cherokees. Same PTU, Same RDM just different programming and control on the Cherokee.

I can provide part numbers if you don't believe as well.

 

[1350S]

How can we apply this to the Pentastar?
https://youtu.be/8LKB6fBYVaw

 

[Tyler-98-W68]

How can we apply this to the Pentastar?
https://youtu.be/8LKB6fBYVaw

Why apply that to a pentastar when you have the following FI kits, but you will notice they all have 1 thing in common.........RWD and longitudinally mounted engine not FWD and transverse mount. That is the crutch trying to mount things when the engine is"sideways"

https://www.rippmods.com/
http://sprintexusa.com/jeep-jk-wrangler-3-6l/
https://prodigyperformance.com/products/dodge-challenger-twin-turbo-kit/


So who cares about what GM is doing, just figure out how to adapt one of those kits and boom

 

[lightsout190]

Not relevant. There are more than plenty of them running well over 400HP because they are modified.

Then there's this old car:
https://www.automobilemag.com/news/dodge-neon-srt4-stage3-2/

I see what your saying, there are allot of FWD cars out there pushing over 300 HP and over 300 ft lbs of torque. And you could add mods to just about any car increasing the power significantly. But I just feel that putting allot of power and torque into a FWD car is not the best option. AWD no problem. Not saying it can’t be done, just pointing out that ideally is not the best type of drivetrain to use for a performance car. I used to drive a Chevy Cobalt SS Supercharged that put out over 200 HP which was allot for a small FWD car that was pretty light. And it could really move. But at really high speeds and hard acceleration I always felt that it dint have the best handling. My friend had the same car but he put tons of mods in his and claimed that it put out close to 300 HP. When I drove it, it had tons of power but I could see the flaws. When I drove a 3 serious BMW which had similar power to the Cobalt SS and was RWD it felt more natural.

At the end of the day the point I was trying to make was in relation to this topic of putting turbo chargers into the 200 v6. Yes I suppose it is possible but maybe won’t have the best results. The AWD version I suppose would be more suitable due to the extra traction and the torque being split up between the front and back.


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[lightsout190]

Why apply that to a pentastar when you have the following FI kits, but you will notice they all have 1 thing in common.........RWD and longitudinally mounted engine not FWD

That is exactly the point I have been arguing in this tread regarding the 200 being FWD.



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[lightsout190]

I can assure you the awd system on the 2015-2017 200's IS the SAME as the AWD system on the Cherokees, more specifically the Active Drive 1 System available on the cherokees. Same PTU, Same RDM just different programming and control on the Cherokee.

I can provide part numbers if you don't believe as well.

I trust what your saying, the components and the system itself are the same. What I was more referring to was more on how the systems work. With the Cherokee you have allot of control over how you use the system. Where as with the 200 the car does everything for you and you don’t even notice it. What I will say is that the 200 handles better in the rain than any other car I have driven.


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[1350S]

Why apply that to a pentastar when you have the following FI kits, but you will notice they all have 1 thing in common.........RWD and longitudinally mounted engine not FWD and transverse mount. That is the crutch trying to mount things when the engine is"sideways"

https://www.rippmods.com/
http://sprintexusa.com/jeep-jk-wrangler-3-6l/
https://prodigyperformance.com/products/dodge-challenger-twin-turbo-kit/


So who cares about what GM is doing, just figure out how to adapt one of those kits and boom

That's a great idea but with the passenger upper engine mount taking up a massive amount real-estate that could other wise be used for a supercharger pulley belt, and the lack of hood room, a blower is out of the question. A turbo seems as though the only plausible option. I really believe that the GM LF4 turbos could be easily adapted, the LF4 air to water intake manifold doesn't seem possible though. The location where the shutters reside has a lot of room for an air to air inner-cooler also. It's a shame that we couldn't use some of Europes electric turbo technology that they use on their OEM cars, I think it will be several yrs down the road before a good reliable system makes it to the aftermarket.

 

[1350S]

I see what your saying, there are allot of FWD cars out there pushing over 300 HP and over 300 ft lbs of torque. And you could add mods to just about any car increasing the power significantly. But I just feel that putting allot of power and torque into a FWD car is not the best option. AWD no problem. Not saying it can’t be done, just pointing out that ideally is not the best type of drivetrain to use for a performance car. I used to drive a Chevy Cobalt SS Supercharged that put out over 200 HP which was allot for a small FWD car that was pretty light. And it could really move. But at really high speeds and hard acceleration I always felt that it dint have the best handling. My friend had the same car but he put tons of mods in his and claimed that it put out close to 300 HP. When I drove it, it had tons of power but I could see the flaws. When I drove a 3 serious BMW which had similar power to the Cobalt SS and was RWD it felt more natural.

At the end of the day the point I was trying to make was in relation to this topic of putting turbo chargers into the 200 v6. Yes I suppose it is possible but maybe won’t have the best results. The AWD version I suppose would be more suitable due to the extra traction and the torque being split up between the front and back.


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I had a buddy that had a Cobalt SS, the turbo version and it was about 500hp, when you punched it going down the road, it wanted to torque steer right off the road, one of the few vehicles I feared aside from my Hemi Dakota I built. I totally agree with you that some vehicles just aren't meant to be more powerful. However I do believe the 200 is a good platform and capable of way more power, but the lack of traction and under hood room is really what's holding us back, that's what you get when you put a 300hp V6 in a Dodge Dart, Ha!

 

[Tyler-98-W68]

Fun fact. The Audi RS3 Sportback has the same AAM Ecotrac AWD system that is in the 200 and cherokee, so its more than capable of handling lots of HP, in the Audi's case 400HP

 

[Black Knight]

I never knew that about the Audi.

I am sure the FWD versions of Cherokee and 200 can handle it as well, as was stated - unfortunately no one makes a kit for the transverse mounted Pentastar powered vehicles - but it has nothing to do with the drive-train not being able to "handle" the power OR it being FWD based.

That's just downright hilarious to think there isn't other serious aftermarket out there for FWD/transverse mounted engine based vehicles BECAUSE of being FWD.

 

[1350S]

Here's an alternative to our dilemma.
https://www.nitrousexpress.com/20971-10-36l-v6-dodge-plate-system-w-10-lb-bottle.html

 

[Crazcnuk]

The problem, these days, is that 300hp, 300ft/bs is only average. You can go to great expense and just end up with an average runner.

Somewhere on this site a 200 owner posted his 1/4mile time slips and he was running in the low 13s with a more or less stock 200. My buddy drag raced his 1979 Camaro Z-28 (350, 4bbl, auto) for decades running 15.2 in Sportsman class. So running low 13s is pretty good for a family car.

Modded Demons and Hellcats are getting into mid 9s, though, so what exactly is it you want to shoot for?

You would be far better off buying a 10yr old muscle car and playing with it than trying to make the 200 into something it isn't.

 

[lightsout190]

I’m curious, the 200s AWD is supposed to do 0-60 in 6 seconds according to the specs. Has anyone ever tested that.


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[lightsout190]

I can assure you the awd system on the 2015-2017 200's IS the SAME as the AWD system on the Cherokees, more specifically the Active Drive 1 System available on the cherokees. Same PTU, Same RDM just different programming and control on the Cherokee.

I can provide part numbers if you don't believe as well.

Here is an interesting article about the AWD and 4X4 systems of FCA cars including the 200 and Cherokee.

https://www.tflcar.com/2015/03/chrysler-dodge-jeep-4x4-awd-systems-snow-ice/

 

[Black Knight]

The problem, these days, is that 300hp, 300ft/lbs is only average.

I respectfully disagree. I get what you are saying but I think the majority of the vehicles actually on the road do not fall into that category. Just because there are a few upper trim family sedans with near that spec doesn't mean it's average for a middle weight vehicle.

Average is still not quite 200HP for a sedan... Look at rental car fleets. So many 4cyl Altima's, Camry's and what have you. The 200 with a 184HP 4 cylinder outsold the V6 by a large margin. Next time you are on the road, look around, most vehicles don't even have 200HP.

Just because there are a few high priced fairly rare/ridiculously expensive/bad to the bone 700HP engines out there doesn't make 300HP average now.

If 300HP was average, a Corolla would have ~260HP lol... The V6 200 would have near 500HP.

I like muscle cars and old 70's cars, but I don't want some outdated factory under-powered (HP per liter) gas hog, 3-speed automatic carburated RWD car with a live rear axle to drive back and forth to work and wrench on every 5 minutes. I have already been there and done that and wrote the book. I get enough of that with my RWD 98 Dakota - but I really like my truck.

My 200 would run circles around my old 78 Camaro with a 71' 350 pulled from a Corvette AND I can drive it in the snow and get traction, and get more than teens for MPG - let's not start talking about handling...

If a person can't ever get past being old school and can't recognize anything besides a live axle rear drive car made to go down the 1/4 mile and no need to turn left or right more than a few MPH... then OK.. the 200 isn't worth modification. It doesn't fit that category. Don't get me wrong. I would love a restored 70 Olds 442.. yeah I know a ton of people hate on the 455 rocket etc... but it has something these new cars being stamped just don't have. Hard to describe it.

10 year old muscle car won't work for me either... Snow. MPG. Still too old. I need a sedan. I don't want to have a car payment for buying gasoline. Could I have bought an AMG E63 used for the same as my car new? Sure - with too many miles, inherited issues and poor MPG.

So what does that leave one to do? Enjoy what they have and make the best of it.

Sorry to go off topic.

 

[Black Knight]

I’m curious, the 200s AWD is supposed to do 0-60 in 6 seconds according to the specs. Has anyone ever tested that.


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Yep. Do a search on here.

Auto editors have tested the 15+ FWD @ 5.7 0-60 on regular gas and 6.0 for the AWD.